Teachers in America
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Teachers in America
Turning Appreciation into Action with Secretary of Education Miguel Cardona
In honor of 2024 Teacher Appreciation Week, Secretary of Education Miguel Cardona joins HMH's CEO Jack Lynch to discuss pressing issues in education. Together, they explore the integration of AI in the classroom, tackling teacher burnout, competitive salaries, and building respect for the teaching profession. Plus, Secretary Cardona shares an experience for his early days as a teacher and advice from influential educators that have stuck with him throughout his career.
Teachers in America profiles K–12 teachers across the country. Hear firsthand from the people who are shaping young lives in the classroom every day. If you or someone you know would be a good candidate for Teachers in America, please email us at shaped@hmhco.com.
On average, teachers make 24% less than people with similar degrees in other professions. Why do we normalize that? You know the profession is about 75% women. Would it be the same if it were 75% men? And you know we have to have these conversations and if our country is going to grow the way it should grow, if we're going to lead the world the way I expect us to lead the world because we have the potential, then we need to invest in our educators differently.
Speaker 2:Welcome to Teachers in America, a podcast from HMH. Today I'm pleased to introduce a very special episode featuring US Secretary of Education Miguel Cardona, interviewed by HMH's CEO, jack Lynch. We hope you'll enjoy this conversation honoring the teachers in America during Teacher Appreciation Week.
Speaker 3:Well, welcome, Secretary Cardona, to this very special episode for Teacher Appreciation Week. So it is great to have you back.
Speaker 1:Great to be back and really want to just say happy Teacher Appreciation Week. So it is great to have you back, great to be back and really want to just say happy Teacher Appreciation Week. Every week should be Teacher Appreciation Week, but this is a really important week for us to really acknowledge the great work that our educators do across the country.
Speaker 3:Now, given that it's Teacher Appreciation Week. We know you, prior to becoming Secretary of Education, have had a rich and diverse career in education. I was wondering if you could share some of your most memorable experiences from the time you spent in the classroom.
Speaker 1:Well, geez, I have to think back to the last century to recall. Look, you know, once a teacher, always a teacher, and those years of serving as a fourth grade teacher for me have impacted me in this role more than any other role. I tell you a story my first year teaching you know, you're just trying to get through the year with a smile on your face and it was a really amazing year. And I remember the last day of school. I had a young man named Hassan. He was such a smart kid, he's just really intelligent. And on the last day of school, his father comes up to see me and says hey, Mr Cardona, you know we're going to have a long summer and I want to keep him busy doing good things. Could you give him some work over the summer? And the poor kid, he's nine years old, he's like, oh really, dad, Like why would you do this? Why would you say this? And I'm thinking, you know, I wanted to help this kid out. I didn't want to bury him in packets, you know. So I said you know what, Hassan? Now this is like 90s, right? I said, Hasan, you're a smart kid and you're really good with technology, right? Could you make our school a website over the summer and I just literally said it on a whim, you know, Could you just make our school a website? And he liked that because he's like good, I get to be on my computer and do things. You know, All kidding aside, I didn't think about it all summer.
Speaker 1:The first day of school the following year, he shows up really excited to show me what he did over the summer. He created an HTML code, which was back then. That wasn't as easy to do. Now you didn't have websites that allow you to create a website. He created, coding, a website for the whole school and I know he did it because some of the words were misspelled. But he had the bio of the nurse, he had a bio of the principal, the classrooms. I was just blown away. When you just, you know, put a challenge out there, Students rise to the occasion and great, great experience, Great memory for me, and I was just like awestruck at what he was able to do.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, it's a. It's a great story, Secretary, and you know it's a win, win. It was a win for Hassan's father and a win for Hassan, Hassan's father and a win for Hassan. And I think it's also a great story about how impactful teachers are for their students. We often think of teachers. There's a narrative out there that teachers are kind of a mechanism for standards-based instruction which really trivializes their impact on engaging and inspiring and mentoring students, and this is a great story that kind of reinforces that very deep connection a teacher has with their student.
Speaker 1:Absolutely yeah, he wanted to impress and let me tell you, he exceeded our expectations. His website was better than the actual website we had for the school. And you're right. I mean, look, I wouldn't be here if it weren't for a teacher that I looked up to, and any word that the teacher said I hung on it because I had so much respect for that teacher. I always say we have to name them publicly. For me it was Mr O'Neill and Ms Ransom. I wouldn't be Secretary of Education if it wasn't Ms Ransom saying you know, miguel, I think you'd make a good teacher. So you're absolutely right.
Speaker 3:So how has that classroom experience really influenced the work that you do today?
Speaker 1:You know, significantly, I recognize that it's not just curriculum, it's not just standards, while that's really important. I'm reminded of what I was told when I was a student teacher by Rindy Hardy, another teacher that influenced me as I was coming up in the profession. She said, miguel, never forget this is the last day of student teaching. Never forget you teach kids, not curriculum, and that stuck with me. I knew what she meant.
Speaker 1:You know, yes, have high standards, but connect with them as people first.
Speaker 1:And to this day, to this day, there's not a policy that goes forward, there's not an action that we take at the Department of Education that is not influenced by the person that we're going to be touching, whose lives we're going to be touching, the decisions that we make at the Department of Education.
Speaker 1:Me, as secretary, I have to make a through line to helping children and connecting to children, and my experience as a teacher really helped me make that possible. Because there are times where I look at what we're doing at the Department of Education and saying, look, are we creating obstacles for educators to be able to connect with students? Are we over prescribing what we think needs to happen from DC? That's not the approach that is going to work. I've also learned that engaging educator voice, teacher voice is part of the solution. Oftentimes we think you know when we do things to schools or to districts that we're going to get the best results. That's absolutely false. It's when we engage and have authentic ownership and engagement in the problem solving with our teachers is when we see the best results.
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely yeah, and I think that you know, given your experience, you have a natural empathy for what a teacher is going through in a day to day, and using that as a filter through which you look at policy and determine, determining how this is going to affect teaching and learning at a very personal level is really, really important.
Speaker 3:So I want to turn to another important topic, uh gender, the ai uh, which I know is something that uh, you have uh spent a lot of time in, invest a lot of time in with you and your staff, and at HMH, we share your vision of using AI responsibly to extend not replace, but extend and empower teachers. So, in particular, two recommendations have been made by the Office of Education Technology that resonate with us. One is to keep a human in the loop, and then the second is to inform and involve educators around designing and developing and testing and implementing AI-enabled education technology. As we continue to explore how best to harness the power of AI to improve teaching learning, we'd love to hear your thoughts about the most exciting ways that AI could transform educators' experience and support student success.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Teachers in the during the pandemic, that there is no substitute for that in-classroom experience. No amount of Zoom or technology can replace that experience of being a part of something bigger than yourself in a classroom and having an educator who's connecting with you. You know, when my kids were learning remotely, they missed that sense of community. So we should learn from that that no amount of AI can replace that relational development and that sense of community that that classroom teacher directs in his or her classroom. And then, as I said in my earlier response, you can't improve education without making sure that teachers' fingerprints are all over that plan.
Speaker 1:Second to parents teachers know those children more than anyone else and they know the impacts of policy more than anyone else. Second to parents so I think you know and I learned this the hard way when I was a school principal I remember getting certified in I think it was data-driven decision-making right. That was like a three-day conference or whatever. So I got this certificate that made me the expert in it. And then I go into the building and I'm trying to roll this out, realizing no, I'm missing the point. I need to build capacity of the concepts of it and then ask teachers to think about how we can make it work in our school. And when I let go, it excelled. It exceeded my expectations and our students did better. So similarly with implementation of AI, we need to make sure not only are we building support and capacity for our educators, we're helping, you know. We're creating an environment where they can help communicate and usher in what it means for that school community. You know I'll take a step back and say I'm excited about the potential here.
Speaker 1:Yeah it's a little nerve wracking because there's a whole new body of work here, but I don't profess to be the expert in it. I think this is an exciting opportunity where we create structures where we share not only the opportunities but the guardrails that we need for our students to be safe, unlike what we didn't do when the Internet came out, there were no guardrails and we saw what happened there, or social media. Now we're starting to put in guardrails, you know. So we have to learn from that and put guardrails, but let's see where it goes.
Speaker 1:You know, just like Hassan created a website before this was in vogue, imagine the potential of our country when we unleash in increments that are age appropriate for students an opportunity to explore artificial intelligence, to enhance learning, not replace. But I think we're going to go from a system of analog learning or rote learning to really creative, problem solving and engaging instruction and learning, and I think in many ways it could help accelerate the shift away from memorization and facts or test prep. You know we need to get away from that. We need to give our students better, and I know our teachers have been thirsting for that for years. So I'm really excited about this. That's great.
Speaker 3:And I think it also has the opportunity to increase teacher capacity and productivity helping them, you know, free them, if you will, performing all the ministerial tasks that they can delegate to you know, a virtual assistant, if you will and at the same time get feedback to students much more quickly and much more effectively. We just recently acquired a business called Writeable, which is using generative AI for writing practice. If you think about the amount of time and effort that goes into giving really good feedback in a revision process to students, it's a lot, and so students don't get as much practice as they ordinarily should. But with you know, that kind of support of generative AI, the teacher is able to increase their capacity and get students really good feedback on a much more timely basis than they would otherwise.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that sounds exciting. You know, and you're absolutely right. Not only are there benefits for students, but benefits for educators. You know, and I think one of the things that I want to just point out that we also have to learn from our history when it comes to innovation and education is that we need to invest time in educator development. We can't expect, after you know half an hour, you know, drive by staff meeting on AI that they're going to be experts and then we expect them to do something without giving them the support and professional development that they need to be to grow in their craft. Right, we can. You know the days of squeezing everything into a one hour staff meeting or, you know, during a prep time. It's just, we got to make sure that we're investing in our educators to develop those skills to be successful. So that's a challenge that I have out there as well. You know, if we're serious about seeing AI really transform education, we need to make sure that we're providing time to give our educators the opportunity to learn and grow with it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, exactly, secretary. A few moments ago you mentioned the word guardrails, so I wanted to ask you about guardrails and, in particular, thinking about the federal role in regulating AI. How are you and your team trying to navigate the need to protect the role of teachers in education and student privacy while also allowing enough room for innovation, what you're talking about earlier and you're coming back with data-driven instruction?
Speaker 1:Well, you know this really goes to the top. The president put out an executive order that has tentacles in many different agencies, not just mine, to make sure that while we embrace the potential, we're also protecting our students, our families, our national intelligence, our defense data, our banks. You know there's a lot of risk if not controlled well and, with regard to education, as I said earlier, you know it has the potential to unleash it. Our report that we published in May of last year starts to get into what that means and what it could look like. We are starting to see models of districts that are thinking about it in a way that says how do we bring the people to the table? It can't be done to a district. It has to be done with a district right, parent engagement, a better understanding of what the potentials are, what the risks are. You know there's a lot of bias, risk in AI and as the systems get better, we also have to be aware at what point, you know, do we bring things in front of students or give them an opportunity to explore it, knowing that you know we need to protect them. So that process, to me, is a process that we do with folks and because it's changing so quickly.
Speaker 1:I don't profess that we're going to be ahead of the curve on this. We have to see how it goes and as it grows, we look for ways that it can be authentically engaged in instruction. But make no mistake, it cannot replace an educator. Be authentically engaged in instruction but make no mistake, it cannot replace an educator. It cannot replace the school experience. I don't even know that there are pockets of people saying that it can. It can enhance learning. I think that, as I said earlier, the experience with the pandemic you can have the best technology, the best curriculum online. There's no replacing an educator in the classroom and the relational foundation that a teacher provides with children. Everything else comes after and you know, for us it's about student safety, protecting their rights and ensuring that whatever tool we use whether it's AI, laptop, doesn't matter it's enhancing learning, not replacing a person or a curriculum.
Speaker 3:Right exactly. As you may know, Secretary, we conduct an annual survey of teachers and education leaders called the Educator Confidence Report. That looks at the sentiment of educators across a number of topics, and what we found in a most recent report and survey is that 82% of teachers want a more fellow educators and students and the social emotional needs of students. What role do you think your office can play in mitigating these?
Speaker 1:issues such as teacher burnout and staffing shortages. You know I've been unapologetic, outspoken advocate for lifting the profession, and what I mean by lifting it is giving it the dignity that it deserves. When we talk about teacher shortages, I talk about them as a symptom of a teacher respect issue in this country. I talk about the ABCs of teaching. Agency is A. You know, let's treat them like professionals and let them make decisions. B is better working conditions ensuring that there are enough mental health supports for students and staff, that teachers are not always being asked to do more with less. That teachers are not normalizing working in a 95 degree classroom in June because there's no air conditioning, in a building that's over 100 years old that no other corporation would allow their employees to work in. That's B. C is competitive salary. On average, teachers make 24% less than people with similar degrees in other professions. Why do we normalize that? The profession is about 75% women. Would it be the same if it were 75% men? We have to have these conversations and if our country is going to grow the way it should grow, if we're going to lead the world the way I expect us to lead the world because we have the potential, then we need to invest in our educators differently. I always say you know, we want Finland results, but we don't put in Finland investments. So for me, what we're doing at the Department of Education is number one.
Speaker 1:I'm using my platform as a bully pulpit to talk about the importance of elevating the teaching profession, of not just talking about it during Teacher Appreciation Week, but really when it's contract time, when it's time to you know, look at ratios of teachers and students providing mental health supports in the community and for educators. I talk about teacher professional development. You know teachers pay out of their pocket to go to conferences on weekends. What other profession does that really call out what has been normalized and and just really revisit how we support or don't support our educators. There's a. There's an you know a term like the martyrdom. I say we've accepted martyrdom when teachers are making.
Speaker 1:There's some States in our country where teachers start at $38,000 a year. That's unacceptable. That's basically saying you're going to have to get another job to make ends meet and in too many of our states teachers qualify for state assistance. We're okay with that in this country. So my mentality is let's set the bar high. Why are we not talking about teachers making $100,000 a year. If they're responsible for meeting the needs of our learners, who have increased need, mental health need, why are we not talking about that? You know we're pushing to provide public service loan forgiveness for teachers that have worked 10 years, that have paid their loans for 10 years. We're eliminating debt. I've talked to teachers that have had over $100,000 in debt relieved.
Speaker 1:But we have to do a better job, making sure the working conditions are adequate, making sure the salary is competitive, or else we're going to have a bunch of schools with a lot of substitute teachers and we're going to be expecting our students to meet the demand of this country. So when you ask me, what am I doing about it? Yes, we have grants. We have the Augusta Hawkins grant that pays for Grow your Own programs. We have over a billion dollars in teacher quality programs.
Speaker 1:You know the president. This president has done more in education for three years in three years than I've seen in my 25-year career in education $130 billion when he walked in the door with the American Rescue Plan. The BISCIP plan put $2 billion in mental health supports and safer school environments and we're going to continue. If you look at our annual budget, we're going to continue fighting for our profession, for our educators, but at all levels.
Speaker 1:You know, I always say it's not just the federal government. Our states, our local districts need to recognize you either pay a competitive salary now or you're going to pay later when you don't have enough teachers to fill the classrooms. Our students deserve better and for me, any opportunity I get, including this one, to say it loud and proud. I'm going to say it because I know these teachers are going to work no matter what and it's not fair that we take advantage of it. Knowing that our country's growth is in the balance. We need to step up for teachers. We're doing it in our policy, in our words and in our actions, and it's something that I take great pride in, not only during Teacher Appreciation Week but throughout the year, to say, you know, let's stand up for our teachers. They stood up for our kids. We need to step up.
Speaker 3:Well said and I agree that you know we have normalized low pay and these conditions and it's great to see what you're doing to help mitigate those concerns. One of the things that education leaders did during and after the pandemic is used ESSER funding and for a number of different purposes, but one of the things that they did was they used ESSER funding to address this intractable problem of low teacher pay and now, as a result, the cost structures reflect many school districts where low teacher, where you've remedied that particular issue of low teacher pay through the ESSER funds. But these are one-time non-re. It's a one-time non-refunding source. Have you been talking about schools, about how they can sustain that investment?
Speaker 1:Yes, and I have to say we've been working with governors, with state legislators, across the country. We have about 29 states just last year alone that have increased teacher salary. We want more, but we are seeing that shift. And you're right, the American Rescue Plan dollars were just that rescue dollars, recovery dollars. It wasn't intended to make up for decades of underinvestment by states. The federal government pays 9% of all education funding just 9%. The other 91% also has to step up.
Speaker 1:So my mentality is look, let's match the urgency of the president when it comes to education funding and if you look at our annual budget, we're seeking to increase Title I by 11%.
Speaker 1:That goes to the schools that have the greatest need. So you'll see, in our annual budget we're really pushing for additional education dollars. I'm going to be in front of Capitol Hill at some of these hearings that are going to go on four to five hours, fighting for a budget that reflects that we need to continue to invest in education and that responsibility goes across the board. So, while we're recognizing that the American Rescue Plan dollars, the BISCA dollars, which is again $2 billion for mental health, has a sunset, we're also fighting for the annual budget. We're fighting to make sure that there's sustainable dollars there and I think that's an all hands on deck proposition that we're proud to fight and I'm proud to stand up the president's record. Meanwhile, you know I was dealing with proposals from the other side that were calling for 80% cut to Title I. That's a 200,000 teachers across the country. You know we have to do better. We have to do better across the country.
Speaker 3:You know we have to do better. We have to do better. Given it's Teacher Appreciation Week, what are the top three things we can do?
Speaker 1:as a country to foster a broader appreciation for teachers. Well, look, I said it before and I'm going to say it again what we need to do are the ABCs of teaching provide agency and treat our teachers like the professionals that they are and allow for their voice, allow for their input on the things that we're doing to improve our schools and our districts and our communities. That's agency B is better working conditions. Ensure that they have the tools that they need to do their jobs, that they're not digging into their pocket anytime they need to do something for students, despite being paid 24 percent less than other professions of similar degrees. Ok, and that their schools have the ample resources so that you know kids can get the supports that they need.
Speaker 1:Our teachers are wearing many hats. We need to provide better working conditions for our educators and see competitive salary. You know we have to stop what I call the martyrdom, where we make teachers feel guilty if they're advocating for competitive salary. And some folks try to turn it around and say you're not for the kids if you're fighting for competitive salary. Absolutely wrong. We want the best for our kids and we're not going to be able to sustain high-quality teachers in our classrooms if we're not investing in our educators. Investing in our educators is investing in our students in our schools.
Speaker 1:So for me, it's the ABCs keep it simple, and I think that's the message. I felt that way when I was a fourth grade teacher. I felt that way all the way through to secretary of education and as a father of two students who attended public schools, I feel that way as a father. So ABCs happy teacher appreciation week. Great to be with you today. I really appreciate you giving me some time to talk about the best profession that there is and one that changes the world so thank you.
Speaker 3:That's a great way to finish, Secretary Cardona. Thank you so much for being so generous with your time and showing your appreciation for our nation's teachers.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you all I really appreciate it and thanks for all you do to really uplift the profession and your contribution to what I think is a really important topic at this time in our country.
Speaker 3:Great. Thank you, secretary, take care.
Speaker 2:If you or someone you know would like to be a guest on the Teachers in America podcast, please email us at shaped at HMHCOcom. Be the first to hear new episodes of Teachers in America by subscribing on Apple Podcasts, spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts. If you enjoyed today's show, please rate, review and share it with your network. You can find the transcript of this episode on our Shape blog by visiting hmhcocom. Forward slash shape. The link is in the show notes. The Teachers in America podcast is a production of HMH. Executive producers are Christine Condon and Tim Lee. Editorial direction is by Christine Condon. It is creatively directed and audio engineered by Tim Lee. Our producer and editor is Jennifer Carujo. Production designers are Mia Fry and Thomas Velazquez. Shape block post editors for the podcast are Christine Condon, jennifer Carujo and Alicia Ivory. Thanks again for listening.